Interview with redjuice and Mai Yoneyama - My decade of experience as a working adult has taught me that there are things more important than illustration technique.
Interview/Editing: rukaku
Photos: Miyuki Uesaka
In recent years, there have been a large number of young illustrators whose careers have taken off while they were still in their teens, which makes the perspective of these two illustrators particularly interesting, since both could be called “late bloomers,” debuting as creators after ten years’ worth of experience in the workforce. We asked them both, “What would you say is more important than an artist’s illustration technique?”
Index
- The moment I thought: “A new generation has arrived.”
- I cut my teeth as an illustrator during pixiv’s daily “ranking battles”
- The determination and agony inherent in becoming a full-time illustrator
- Mai Yoneyama’s “Movement” and redjuice’s “Stillness”
- The aesthetics of “hybrids”
- Balancing creativity and business
- The importance of communication and respect when working with others
- Just reading a book is not learning
- redjuice’s solo exhibition “REDBOX” is open now!
- redjuice
Illustrator/Designer
An illustrator and designer who hails from Tosakiyomizu City, Aichi Prefecture.
As a member of the creative unit “supercell” led by songwriter ryo, he created the image illustration for “World is Mine,” which, along with the song, became a big hit, and was also in charge of the original character designs for the TV animation, “Guilty Crown.” Since then, he’s been active as an illustrator, known for the original character designs for all 2015 “Project Itoh” movie releases (Genocidal Organ, Harmony, The Empire of Corpses) and the character and concept designs for the novel and TV anime, “BEATLESS,” among others.
His illustrations, with their uniquely expressive atmosphere that cannot be pinned down into a single genre or category, have received high acclaim both in Japan and overseas.
- Mai Yoneyama
From Nagano Prefecture.
In addition to being active as an illustrator, she has also released buzzworthy commercials and music videos as an animator. On top of that, even while holding various solo exhibitions, she proactively continues to seek out the latest technologies for her creative process, always on the lookout for new possibilities in digital illustrations. After working for an animation company, she’s been working as an illustrator since 2018, handling advertisements and book covers. In 2019, she held her first solo exhibition, “SHE,” and another solo exhibition in 2021, “EGO.” She has garnered attention for her many layered acrylic works using UV printing. Her work “00:00:00:00” is a collective work consisting of 16 pieces symbolizing the artist’s history as an illustrator who has roots in animation. It was exhibited at the “START ART FAIR 2021” exhibition in Saatchi Gallery in London, England.
The moment I thought: “A new generation has arrived.”
── I heard that the two of you have met at events a number of times before today’s interview. First off, can you please tell us what your first impressions of each other were?
Mai Yoneyama: redjuice writes a lot about techniques and other useful things on his blog. That’s also where he uploaded plug-ins and brushes that others can use. It wasn’t that unusual for people to share their knowledge like that, but not that many people went so far as to help directly in such a practical way. It really left an impression on me.
redjuice: If you ask me why I did it, it’s because all those programs, whether SAI or CLIP STUDIO PAINT or whatever else, all had default presets, but I’d always felt those weren’t quite what I was looking for. These days, a huge number of different brushes are available by default from installation, and brushes made by users are largely made available to the public as resources. When I think about it, what I did could have been a kind of forerunner for that kind of movement.
Mai Yoneyama: I most certainly recognize that.
redjuice: To add to the talk about brushes, I want to say something about pencil-type brushes. When working with actual pencils, you have a certain intuition about what you can or can do, right? I originally drew line drawings on paper, but whenever I did it digitally, I found myself having trouble with “slide” and “smear” sensations. With the motive of wanting to bring that “intuition” or instinctive feel of a brush or pen to my digital work, I tried making my own brushes on Photoshop and CLIP STUDIO PAINT.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s so interesting. You said you originally did line drawings on paper? Then you created brushes to recreate the feeling of writing on paper even digitally.
redjuice: In the beginning, I didn’t have a lightbox either, so I would shine a fluorescent light source from underneath a glass table and do line drawings on paper like that.
Mai Yoneyama: Wow! I had no idea! (laughs)
redjuice: Yeah, that was my workaround. That was the very technique I used when I made my first draft of “World is Mine.”
Mai Yoneyama: You drew it out in pencil and then transferred it?
redjuice: Yes, I scanned it.
Mai Yoneyama: Did I just get an exclusive? (laughs)
── redjuice, what was your first impression of Yoneyama?
redjuice: I thought it was remarkable that she was originally working as an animator, but has incredible instincts for expression when it comes to illustrations as well. Seeing her work makes me think that a new generation of illustrators is already here.
Mai Yoneyama: That makes me so happy. Thank you.
redjuice: Yoneyama-san and I met Kei Mochizuki at a game’s thank-you party the other day. At that time, both of you had this powerful aura that made it really hit home, like, “A new generation has arrived!”
Mai Yoneyama: It might just be me who thinks this, but I think there’s something like a synergy between illustrators who started around the same time. I have that feeling with Kei Mochizuki and LAM, for example, even though I’m older than them. However, I had a later start as an illustrator, so I feel like we’re of the same generation.
redjuice: What do you mean, a later start??
Mai Yoneyama: Up until 2018, I was working as an animator and animation director for Trigger. I was doing just anime for about ten years.
redjuice: So you already had a ten-year career under your belt.
Mai Yoneyama: I only started properly doing illustration when I entered the latter half of my 20s, so that’s on the late side.
redjuice: There’s a fair amount of people out there who do both animation and illustration, but although many tend to lean heavier on the anime side, you mainly focus on doing illustrations, right?
Mai Yoneyama: That’s right.
redjuice: I really think the change of careers was a great choice for you.
I cut my teeth as an illustrator during pixiv’s daily “ranking battles”
── Next, I’d like to ask you both about what inspired you to change from your corporate jobs to your current careers in illustration.
redjuice: I studied mechanical engineering as a student, so the first company I worked for did designs for freezers and air conditioners. I also did CAD but when I was around 24, I quit my previous mechanical engineer job and moved to Tokyo. I had this desire to be a creator, a “wannabe” so to speak. At that time I had no skills in drawing, but wanted to be a 3D creator, so I took a Softimage course at Digital Hollywood.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s fascinating.
redjuice: However, I wasn’t able to level up the way I wanted during my time in vocational school. For the record, I was able to make 1-minute animations and model robots and such, so I probably could have tried to get into a game company or something, but even for that what I could do was pretty weak in terms of portfolio. You could say that this was my first relatively big setback.
Mai Yoneyama: Nowadays, a 3D artist that could do that would be especially useful for those companies, though.
redjuice: The biggest problem was that I didn’t have the fundamental art skills or knowledge. I couldn’t draw characters at all. When I did character designs for 3D animation, I just found it depressing. I kept coming face-to-face with the fact that I couldn’t draw people, and would lose all hope. At that point, I didn’t think, “I’m no good if I stay this way, so I should work harder!” Instead, my spirit as a creator vanished.
Mai Yoneyama: I see.
redjuice: After that, while doing a different job, I was diligently uploading my illustrations on drawing forums. As I did that, my artist’s spirit started to bud again little by little. Incidentally, I first started using pixiv when I was 30. The ages of 24 to 30 is sort of like a dark period for me.
Mai Yoneyama: It was your training era.
redjuice: Not quite. It was more like... a blank period. Then pixiv appeared and my zeal for wanting to take the top spot in the rankings steadily began to swell.
Mai Yoneyama: That was a time when everyone was obsessed with the pixiv ranking, wasn’t it?
── Until then, there weren’t any authoritative rankings among illustrators, is that right?
── So, in other words, passionate participation in the intense ranking battles at that time gave you the friendly rivalry that motivated and inspired your own improvement as an illustrator.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s right. While you were fighting it out in the pixiv ranking battle, did you feel you made much improvement?
redjuice: I did. The pixiv rankings had a unique addictiveness to them and were incredibly thrilling. The point count would start at midnight and that’s when I’d post my art and for the next 24 hours, I’d be anxious about it. The results would come out the next day at noon, so I spent every day feeling uneasy.
Mai Yoneyama: I totally understand. I was using a different account that was more for other ideas and concepts, but I would keep clicking on the illustration I posted like my life depended on it, always looking to see if the number of likes had increased.
── During that time, something some people did was post how-to guides for illustrations.
Mai Yoneyama: Yes! They’d post behind-the-scenes things and tips. Those were definitely a huge part of the community culture and helped improve everyone’s drawing skills, I expect.
redjuice: You could get big points for making behind-the-scenes stuff. For some reason, those would always be at the top of the rankings.
Mai Yoneyama: Because there was the help of those tips and making-of submissions, really amazing illustrations were being submitted every day. Each day was like a contest.
redjuice: Not to mention, because it was a nationwide contest, it was practically a national competition.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s why it was pretty amazing to make it into the top 10. Because that would indicate an illustrator’s “rank,” everyone worked so hard. Plus, in the pixiv ranking, it wasn’t just illustrations of cute girls, but also lots of scenery and pieces on the artsy end of things. That’s why we say that the rankings at this time had a very high “purity.”
The determination and agony inherent in becoming a full-time illustrator
── So, pixiv began service in 2007, and amid the ranking battles, redjuice, you rapidly improved in skill. When did you quit your job and start working as a professional illustrator?
redjuice: In the beginning, I was doing illustration jobs on the side while working full-time, but I shifted to full-time illustrating when the jacket for the livetune remix album “Re:MIKUS” was released by Victor Label in March 2009.
redjuice: Incidentally, I drew “World is Mine” in 2008, and at a supercell gathering, ryo asked me, “Why don’t you go pro?” At the time my answer was, “No way, I don’t want to do that. My income would drop significantly.”
Mai Yoneyama: So that was your stance. (laughs)
redjuice: The thing is when you think about how you live your life, no matter what, money will always be an issue. Nowadays, there are times when my income is pretty good, but if you compare it to what I was getting at my previous job at a company, it doesn’t exceed that.
Mai Yoneyama: You’re a very prudent person despite all the work you do. So you’re saying that at that point, you weren’t planning to jump feet first into being an illustrator, right?
redjuice: Absolutely. I intended to be an illustrator just on the side for the rest of my life. There’s a certain amount of determination you need to really jump into going pro. But after that, as I kept getting pulled into all sorts of things, I started to realize, “Am I... in demand as an artist?” I basically came into a self-awareness having become somebody of note even though I’d always been a nobody before. That was the turning point that had me shift to turning pro.
── Mai, up until 2018, you were active as an illustrator while also working as an animation director, right?
Mai Yoneyama: Yes, I was doing both at the same time. Since about 2013. I was working as an animation director, but at that time I wasn’t really making much. I was secretly drawing for social games and magazine-copyrighted illustrations on the side to supplement my income.
redjuice: The pay you get for copyrighted illustrations for magazines wasn’t that great either, right?
Mai Yoneyama: No, it wasn’t. But at that time it was like a reward. While I was doing this, in 2016, Shigeto Koyama, who had fairly regular work with Trigger at that time, spoke to me asking, “Why don’t you give it a shot?” And I ended up in charge of the main visual for “Racing Miku 2016.” I guess that was my first professional-type job that had my name on it.
── redjuice, you were in charge of the first generation Racing Miku illustration for “Racing Miku 2010,” so that’s another thing you two have in common.
Mai Yoneyama: After Racing Miku, various jobs started coming but... that was difficult in and of itself. There are those drawings of characters in a standing pose in video games, right? The type you find in the novel game format where the text is displayed horizontally. I received a lot of work that was like, “You have experience as an animation director and can imitate the designs of other people, plus you can draw illustrations, so we want you to mass produce a design for a standing pose in this person’s art style.” While I was grateful to receive that kind of work, I thought it would be a problem to build my career on that. After that, I started putting out doujinshi, which allowed me to display my own originality, and then I got much more work using my style and design from people who saw my doujinshi.
redjuice: I see.
Mai Yoneyama: In your case, redjuice, people have a specific perception of your work that means people will approach you with work that fits that, like, “This is the kind of illustration I want, and I think redjuice will be able to draw it that way.” However, I didn’t have that kind of “brand image” accumulated, so I had to create it on purpose. That’s why I started publishing doujinshi in 2018, and began to show to the world, “These are the kinds of pictures I draw.”
redjuice: Your first doujinshi was in 2018... Compared to our pixiv era talk, that’s pretty recent.
Mai Yoneyama: It took about a year after I started before I actually got work from the people who saw my doujinshi. So, in my case, it took quite a lot of time until it got to the point where clients would request work done in the “Mai Yoneyama” style of drawing.
Mai Yoneyama’s “Movement” and redjuice’s “Stillness”
── Now that you’ve developed your own distinctive styles as artists and feel that the world recognizes it, what do you think the world appreciates about your art?
── What do you think leaves the greatest impression on people who see your work, other than the elements that are reminiscent of an animation still shot?
Mai Yoneyama: Composition and movement, lines and coloring, and, of course, lighting; also, that they look like they were taken by a camera.
redjuice: That “camerawork” aspect definitely comes through strongly. I think that you’re very conscious of that because of how animators depict distinct movements, and your work has that strong sense of recording “a frame in motion.” There is grand dynamism in your illustrations.
── How about you, redjuice?
── redjuice, you told me earlier that you’re always listening to livetune’s music on repeat. It seems like the play count on your iTunes is pretty amazing.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s so funny. (laughs)
redjuice: You could say that without music, I default to a state of “nothingness,” but when I do listen to music, the world expands within me, the structural outlines and the emotional parts all welling up. I place a lot of importance on expressing those emotions.
Mai Yoneyama: You can get absorbed in redjuice’s pictures with a single glance.
── It feels like there’s a kind of “eternity” or a very long passage of time embedded in redjuice’s illustrations.
redjuice: Certainly, it’s not just a single moment I’m creating. I do feel like I’m painting a scene. But instead of movement, I emphasize stillness in the composition so in that sense it’s “unmoving”. Unlike the “movement” in Yoneyama-san’s illustrations, my illustrations are set in the middle of a kind of “stillness.” I also place a lot of importance on how many technical things can be squeezed in.
Mai Yoneyama: That also comes across clearly.
redjuice: This is always the case in 3D, but it’s an industry that’s going under immense technological innovation day in and day out. When you use old software, you’ll get left further and further behind. Something that would have taken a hundred times longer to do before can easily be done now and I would like to make use of that as I continue to create illustrations, continuously updating the technology and techniques I use.
Mai Yoneyama: I have the image of redjuice not only doing a lot of work, but just generally being high in demand from content creators.
redjuice: Firstly, to an extent, it’s true that you could say that I’m in demand. There’s the expectation that “redjuice should be able to do this.” When that happens, I don’t want to give them 100%, but instead, betray their expectations in a good way by delivering 120%, giving them something that exceeds their expectations. That sounded pretty cool, didn’t it? Too cool? (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: Editor, please put what he just said in bold. (laughs)
The aesthetics of “hybrids”
── It is important to keep in mind the audience’s point of view, the “third person’s point of view,” so to say, but it’s also necessary to have a “first person point of view” that is focused on the things you want to do and continues to seek out originality. What efforts have you made to find that kind of originality for yourself?
Mai Yoneyama: You often get recommendations from other people, right?
redjuice: Do you have anything to recommend, Yoneyama-san?
Mai Yoneyama: I’m actually not what you’d call a device geek, but I love software. I also use 3D and play around with Houdini and Cinema 4D, so I guess you could call me a software otaku.
redjuice: After all’s said and done, it’s keyboards for me. I have a lot of devices I could use just my left hand for, but I hardly ever use them. When it comes to complicated operations, I eventually need the keyboard. Well... Actually, rather than saying I don’t use them, it’s more like I routinely break them and have to fix them, and they end up in a rough state...
Mai Yoneyama: Wow, that’s pretty intense. (laughs)
redjuice: But I think it’s amazing how you’re always on the lookout for all kinds of software, like for 3D.
Mai Yoneyama: I may not be a geek, but I’m addicted to finding new ways to create and express my ideas. I’m always looking for new hybrids. I’m a pretty big believer in fun and interesting things outside of drawing. In that sense, you can probably call me an otaku who likes research. The same goes for optics and printing, too.
redjuice: The laminated printing displayed at your solo exhibition was very innovative. Do you like printing technology?
Mai Yoneyama: I do. Relatedly, I also like greeting cards. When I was a child, during Christmas time, my mom would often give me cards that would play music or light up, as well as red envelopes (T/N: a tradition rooted in Chinese history in which red envelopes with money inside are given to children). Those envelopes were especially ornate.
Mai Yoneyama: They have a strong smell and are extravagant and beautiful with their embossing and foil stamping, and I really like that kind of thing. That’s why when I was younger, I’d go through the trouble of making envelopes laminated with cellophane tape to give to people. (laughs)
Eventually, because I like such things that are devised full of intention, when I examine all the things I like, such as doujinshi or merch, I find myself liking printing techniques more and more. Digital illustrations are, in a sense, completed on a screen, so I always want to create something that crosses “what I like in 3D” with “my drawings.” It would be great if I could create a new genre.
── Recently, Yoneyama, you’ve been putting a lot of work into videos and animation. Eve’s “YOKU” music video and “Reincaranimation,” for example, have left quite the impression.
redjuice: The growth of the music video market has been immense, lately.
Mai Yoneyama: Indie animes are already explosively popular right now. That came from the evolution of tools like CLIP STUDIO PAINT making it easier to make anime, together with social media giving them a platform for them to be posted. It all came with a bang.
── There was a period when the hashtag “#indie_anime” was going viral on X, right?
redjuice: Honestly, the number of creators out there is countless. More and more amazing people are turning up from out of nowhere.
Mai Yoneyama: Truly. I think that having a low threshold to entry really helps in the creative process. It’s a good era right now, one where you can easily create and share your work.
redjuice: Because even Blender is free. (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: Just like with redjuice, I’m influenced by things that bring in another axis into illustrations, like 3D, technology, as well as other people who cannot be easily pigeonholed into a certain genre or category. I think the reason why I love printing has something to do with that.
Balancing creativity and business
── To live as an artist, you end up developing two perspectives. The creative one, in other words, “the things that you truly want to draw,” and the business one, “the things you draw for money.” How do you reconcile, compromise, and have these two factors coexist?
redjuice: How people approach and think about it differs from person to person, like the “artist type” and “business type.” Of course, everyone is balancing both, but I’m more of an “artist type”.
From the geek and otaku technology side of things, I do a lot of things that take a lot of time but don’t make a lot of money. Consequently, I’m not balancing that with the business side very well.
However, if I continue solely like this, then my savings for retirement will disappear too, so I have to draw while thinking about business as well while I still can.
── I feel that monetization is essential to do this work full-time.
redjuice: That’s right. I can’t say that this is a rule but an interesting job isn’t necessarily one that makes a good income. However, if you just focus on business and jobs that make you money, then you’re slowly going to die on the inside. Your spirit will die and you’ll fall ill. That’s why it’s all about balance.
── How do you deal with the balance between creativity and business, Yoneyama?
Mai Yoneyama: I’m not really good at monetization, or rather, following the trail of money...
redjuice: Is that right? (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: More often than not, I’m letting opportunities pass me by. A lot of times, I’ll ask out loud, “Should I have taken that offer?” and will often be met with replies of, “Why didn’t you accept it then?!” Therefore, I’m bad with that side of things and feel like I focus more on originality and creativity.
Regarding the monetization of creativity, I always think about balancing income and expenses before a solo exhibition. I make my own chart of income and expenses and do all the calculations. I like thinking about the things I sell as well as the things I want to get involved in or things that I can buy.
redjuice: That’s very business-like. (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: I’m making good use of my experience from the time I was an animator. In short, things like expecting to sell only 80% or striking a balance are useful skills especially when planning exhibitions.
redjuice: You’re extremely strong.
Mai Yoneyama: I like projects and planning. When all’s said and done, I enjoy being well-received. During solo exhibitions as well, I’m not satisfied unless I’m doing the register myself. Hence, the reason for planning.
── I think that you can harmonize the things you “want to create” and the things “the world wants” really well.
Mai Yoneyama: It’s probably strange for me to be saying this, but I rely on my gut feelings quite a bit. I’m sure that this will change as I get older, but that’s how it is right now.
The importance of communication and respect when working with others
── Harmony between creativity and business is something that doesn’t end once you’ve had that one personal successful experience. You always have to update how you do things for the time and place. Do you have any rules that you feel you have to absolutely follow in order to consistently continue this harmony, which can be very costly to run mentally?
Mai Yoneyama: I try to have respect for every field. As well as gratitude. The results are often better when you respect the thoughts of everyone involved, be they the clients, customers, or the printing committee and business. That’s why I make sure not to challenge the other party without knowing anything about them and try to learn a lot about them beforehand. That’s what respect is to me.
redjuice: I also value respect. The “MIKU FES ‘24 (Spring) - Happy 16th Birthday” visual I completed just recently is an accumulation of respect. When I was first offered this commission I was told, “You’re free to make a new original outfit for it.” But I wanted to express the feeling of the first time I encountered Miku, and so that was the outfit I drew her in. It really is all about gratitude, isn’t it?
Mai Yoneyama: I see. I’ve thought about this before, but it does have a bit of KEI’s flavor, doesn’t it?
redjuice: I did as much as I could to not deviate from the original with the colors and feeling of the outfit, respecting the original design. Maybe I shouldn’t say this myself, but maybe I’m overly invested in this? (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: That just means the fans will be delighted, too.
redjuice: I’m also a fan. I want to have fun with everyone. Vocaloid, in particular, is a collaboration and joint work with other creators. Musicians, video creators... None of it can happen without mutual respect.
Mai Yoneyama: The same goes for me. The more I’m told, “Feel free to do what you like”, the more I do my research. Because isn’t it true that there will always be someone who loves that content more than you? That’s why I try to hold on to the parts that will have those people going, “This artist knows what they’re doing.”
redjuice: You also worked on “FGO” (Fate/Grand Order), right? That must’ve been a lot of work.
Mai Yoneyama: It was tons of fun! I’d love to do it again. (laughs)
redjuice: Did you play FGO?
Mai Yoneyama: I wasn’t deep into playing it. Of course, I knew it, and I also watched the “Fate” series and loved it. It is difficult to find that balance between what would make the customers happy and how much of the things I like I should pack into it. That’s why I want to challenge yet another different balance. Plus, I like “Kashin Koji.”
redjuice: FGO has a strong original story and a strong fanbase, so I know that I can’t take on a challenge like that with a half-hearted attitude. I didn’t know much about the “Fate” series to begin with, but when I was asked to do work for this game, I had a year until the deadline. During that time I watched the anime, played the game, did a lot of research, and thought “Wow, ‘Fate’ has some amazing content.”
Mai Yoneyama: You have to do your research, right? Taking that into account, it’s pretty innovative.
redjuice: In the “Fate” series when it comes to expression, anything goes. Visual-wise, it’s more like, “Is it okay to go that far?” For example, with the characters Shuten-douji and Ishiwakamaru.
Mai Yoneyama: I get you. That’s why the ability to design, or rather, the ability to interpret is important. One important thing I remember is that no matter how I’m asked, I make it so I’m able to explain all the intentions I put into my work. Of course, I create things using my intuition, but I make sure that I’m able to give them an answer if they do ask.
── You mean regarding the color, composition, and what’s being drawn?
Mai Yoneyama: That’s right. I also include things like what inspired the clothing and such.
redjuice: I was invited to a vocational school for a short period a while back, looking over and correcting illustrations. While doing that, I found that the amount of “things that the creator likes” incorporated into the illustration really differentiated the good illustrations from the others.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s exactly right. Superficially, it’s not about technique.
redjuice: It’s easy to see which parts of a picture someone worked particularly hard on, because ultimately the quality of the picture is determined by that depth of interest. Even if it’s not good overall, for example, a picture where the creator was very particular about the details of a musical instrument can really shine in a different way than others. I played a little bit of guitar, so I know the structure and function of each part. Let’s look at pomodorosa’s illustration drawn on this desk here, for instance. Pomodorosa is also a musician, so you can tell that they put a lot of thought into the details of the instrument and the spaces between the frets are perfect. Also, the impression of the fretless neck, PU, and thickness of the strings. This kind of thing, where someone’s “likes” are reflected in the picture is very important. Even if it’s something you don’t like, make an effort to like it. This is something I need to work harder on, too.
── What do you think about the factors beyond what you need to create an illustration? Assuming that the illustration skills are all there, based on your experience, what do illustrators need other than that to succeed, such as long-term relationship with their clients, email communication skills, motivation, mental strength, experience working in other areas, etc.
Mai Yoneyama: The topic of email pains me. (laughs) I’m someone who doesn’t get back to you right away. But people often tell me, “You have a friendly/gentle personality,” which is nice.
Another thing is, I think it’s better to ask someone directly if needed rather than beating around the bush. Asking straight on, “Is this right?” Or “Please show me this!” is something I try to do myself more and more. I don’t let anything remain a mystery. I like talking to people in the first place, so I always try to talk to others. I think that’s how people deepen mutual understanding.
redjuice: Wasn’t that hard to do during COVID?
Mai Yoneyama: It was so hard. There’s something uniquely different about the atmosphere during those remote meetings that makes it difficult to talk. When one person speaks, everyone else is quiet, no one’s nodding or giving verbal responses. You can’t look them in the eyes.
redjuice: You also don’t know when it’s okay to talk, right?
Mai Yoneyama: Even though I can’t say what I want to say, there might be a part of me that’s doing my best through actions. (laughs)
redjuice: These last few years, I finally saw the end of the COVID era but for young people today, for five years, a world where real communication was extinct became the norm for them.
Mai Yoneyama: Recently, because many people are building personal relationships through social media, people are always unexpectedly in some kind of community I didn’t know anything about nowadays. I prefer meeting people and talking with them over drinks.
── Creators’ drinking parties are pretty important, aren’t they?
Mai Yoneyama: I like drinking parties where I can meet and chat with people I trust, not those large ones where there are a ton of people. I’m fundamentally a homebody. (laughs) I think it’s important to have a place where you can organize your thoughts. Fortunately for me, I have a team called “SSS by applibot,” which is a big help because I can have discussions with them.
redjuice: I’m jealous that you have that kind of environment.
Mai Yoneyama: For me, I’m jealous of supercell, too. But yeah, I think that it’s an important component for even individual illustrators to communicate with and be aware of each other.
Just reading a book is not learning
── Lastly, the thing both of you have in common is a commitment to gaining knowledge aside from those related to illustration techniques. For redjuice, since you were a student, you’ve systematically studied a wide range of disciplines such as mechanical engineering, 3D, CG, WEB, natural science, and physics. For Yoneyama, you have ten years' worth of experience as an animator. What do you think about the importance of learning other things besides illustration techniques?
redjuice: "Learning" will never not be useless when it comes to drawing. It doesn’t matter what you learn, be it math, physics, or mechanical engineering. The experience you learn from that will definitely have a function in your art. That’s why I’m not overly conscious about efficiency when it comes to studying, worrying too much about, “I have to be decisive,” or, “I shouldn’t do this.” On the contrary, I think it’s better if one is greedy and honest when it comes to their thirst for knowledge, continuously discovering anything, and believing in that “love.” What’s considered pointless can also become part of a creator’s individuality.
Mai Yoneyama: That’s really good advice.
── I imagine starting something new would have a high hurdle and high cost, mentally. Did you feel any of that, redjuice?
Mai Yoneyama: Respective individuality and abilities emerge in the genre you’re learning, too. redjuice has talked about using a lot of literature as a reference, but I’m bad with literature. However, I have this intuition of cultivating sensitivity, so that’s the way I learn. There are different ways to learn things. At first glance, it may look like there’s only one way to learn, but that’s not the case. It’s exactly as redjuice said earlier, learning something will always bear fruit. When it comes to pictures, there is no such thing as, “I have to do it this way or that way.”
For example, you and another person with the same drawing ability rapidly become skilled and you’re both at the same level of artistic ability. Then, at that point, you have to start thinking about: What makes you unique? What are your strong points? It’s gonna be those supplementary things, the experiences you’ve accumulated and the things that you’ve learned. No matter who you are, there’s something. Everyone isn’t just drawing pictures to draw pictures; that means there’s gotta be something else, some sort of drive, and there’s not a single person out there who is sitting in a vacuum of space taking in absolutely nothing. The ones saying, “I have nothing,” I think they just haven’t started digging yet or aren’t truly following their desires. No matter who you are, you definitely have this inexplicable drive pushing you in one direction or another. More often than not, even strange hobbies can be used in pictures.
redjuice: The one thing you have to pay attention to is that even though we say you should go out there and do something, anything, be careful that you don’t end up just killing time. (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: I’m very prone to that myself. (laughs)
redjuice: For me, once I get addicted to a video game I really dig in.
Mai Yoneyama: Oh, really? (laughs)
redjuice: I was really into online games before, back in the period when I hadn’t made illustration my career yet, to the point that I resented having to go to sleep. I got to a point where I thought, “Oh, this is getting pretty bad.” I haven’t played online games since.
Mai Yoneyama: Online games are really dangerous, aren’t they? (laughs) I get it.
To add to the topic earlier, I’m often asked, “How do I acquire those supplementary things?” And true, at 18 years old, that’s how you think, but someone who is twice that age is going to answer, “Everything you see from here on out will be part of those supplementary things.” So I think a lot of experience will come and be the answer to that question.
── Everyone looks for immediate efficiency, so they tend to say, “It’s better if you do this.”
redjuice: Yeah. This goes for instruction books, as well as the making-of entries in the pixiv ranking we talked about before, but while looking at those things will allow us to get the important points, how do I put this? It’s a very narrow scope. Even those “making-of” creators have to go through numerous accumulations before they get to that point.
That’s why I want to say, “Don’t just rely on that and go buy a book.” I’m often asked with books as well, “What do you recommend?” But I think to myself, “I don’t have a recommendation. Read everything.” Nowadays, you can buy them online and don’t have to go to the bookstore. If there’s a genre of books I want on Amazon, I’ll go and buy three books from that genre. I don’t do that to read and compare, but in my head, I make an index and go, “This book writes this around here,” and it becomes a drawer where I can stock up on things and pull them out to read later when I need it.
── So you’re basically saying that you have to be careful not to get sidetracked, but you also can’t get too caught up in finding the fastest and easiest route to your goal. That, ultimately, it’s more beneficial if you’re unsure of the way forward, and try many ways before finding the one that suits you best. Basically, the journey is the point, not the destination?
redjuice: I agree with that.
Mai Yoneyama: Now there’s AI as well. Because technology can make up for your shortcomings in some ways, once you’re satisfied with what you can produce with it, next comes questions about your aesthetics, concepts, stories, and narratives. Because the only thing that matters is, “What did that person see and how did they interpret it?”
── AI doesn’t have intention and narrative in that sense, right?
── In another interview, redjuice, you mentioned that drama doesn’t show up in AI illustrations.
Mai Yoneyama: Didn’t you say earlier, “I create music videos in my head to start with”? I actually would like to see those. I’d love to see you give film work a try.
redjuice: I can’t draw storyboards... (laughs)
Mai Yoneyama: I think you absolutely can.
redjuice: You think so? (laughs)
redjuice’s solo exhibition “REDBOX” is open now!
redjuice has newly established his new company Red Box! To commemorate the occasion, he will be holding a solo exhibition “REDBOX” from March 22nd, 2024 to April 7th, 2024. The venue will be Yurakucho Marui 8F Marui no Anime SPACE 7 and 8.
The exhibition was crafted to display respect and emotionality towards his works, and is rich with worldbuilding backed by his extensive scientific knowledge. Stop by and have a look!